La Mezquita – Great Mosque in Cordoba, Spain
I do not know how much attention this controversy is receiving or generating outside of the New York City area, but it is a very hot topic here. J.E. Dyer has an excellent piece from his blog cross-posted to Hot Air. Referencing this highly controversial Hot Air column on Tuesday by C.K. MacLeod criticizing the critics of the proposed mosque, Dyer illustrates the historical and semiotic themes behind the mosque and its name.
On the question of the mosque itself, however, I don’t think any treatment of the topic can be complete without reference to the meaning behind the name of the “initiative” that intends to establish it – the Cordoba Initiative – or to the plan to name the mosque Cordoba House. My first question on hearing this a couple of weeks ago was whether Americans are completely ignorant of history.
Cordoba was, of course, the seat of the caliphate established in what is now modern Spain after the Islamic invasion from North Africa in the 8th century A.D. The medieval occupation of Spain – “al-Andalus” – is considered by Islamic theorists to have been an inevitable step in the manifest destiny of Islam, and its eventual reversal through the lengthy European “Reconquista” a tragic but temporary triumph of the infidels. The great mosque at Cordoba was built on the foundation of a Christian cathedral, and when Europeans retook Cordoba in the 13th century they turned the magnificent mosque back into a cathedral.
and furthermore:
“Cordoba,” in Islamic symbolic terms, means Islamic rule in the West. It does not mean “coexistence,” unless coexistence is interpreted as referring to Islamic rule. Pamela Geller at Atlas Shrugs cites the article (original in Arabic) published by Iraqi-American Khudhayr Taher on 18 May, in which Taher explains the following:
We must note that a hostile and provocative name [Cordoba] has been chosen for this mosque…Choosing the name ‘Cordoba House’ for the mosque to be constructed in New York was not coincidental or random and innocent. It bears within it significance and dreams of expansion and invasion [into the territory] of the other, [while] striving to change his religion and to subjugate him…
It used to not even be a stretch for reasonably well educated Westerners to recognize the place of Spain and Cordoba in the history of the West and Islam. Many of today’s younger adults, however, have learned nothing about the Mediterranean before 1492 except that the Muslim period in Spain was a flowering of science, art, and culture. There was a great deal to admire in the accomplishments of the Muslim Cordobans, but they did, in fact, invade and conquer Spain, sell its inhabitants into slavery, provide a base for slaver raids into other parts of Europe, and rule by the sword in much of the caliphate.
{ 19 comments }
I’m often just amazed when people act surprised about the Muslims planned take over of the world and implementation of Sharia law. they are doing nothing more that what they have publicly stated that they intended to do from the inception of this coordinated effort which began during the Regan administration (or earlier most likely). Through our own PC and acceptance of socialist/communist ideas, our election of a Muslim president, and allowing the claims of racial profiling every time there is a fundamental policy difference or disagreement, we allow the leftist to continue to creep forward at every turn. I see no hope for us as a nation, but fortunately I’m pretty old and Obama will be sending me to the cracker factory soon anyway. Nevertheless, I plan to continue to fight all the way.
Where is El Cid when you need him?
Jill Carroll recently wrote in detail about the plan, the building’s actual location, and the people that want to build it. Needless to say, some of the comments are interesting.
I wonder if it will have soft corinthian leather seating?
#3 bob42
An excerpt from your comment left at Jill Carroll’s blog.
Right. That is certainly the cheap, lazy way out of the situation, isn’t ? Just call everyone who disagrees with you a xenophobe. Oh, how clever.
Carroll most definitely did not write in detail about the proposed mosque or the motives and positions of the organization and imam behind it. She wrote about how fabulous her wonderful, wonderful friends are, dahling.
If Abdul Rauf is so wonderful, why would he name this building Cordoba House ?
And why would he say this in an Arab newspaper interview 11 days ago, as described by Rod Dreher at BeliefNet ?
Rauf is a con artist and so is his wife. Nations throughout the West are overrun with Islamic “charities” and mosques which are nothing more than fund-raising devices and indoctrination camps for Wahhabist/Muslim Brotherhood activities.
If Rauf truly cared one wit about the American people he would move his proposed mosque to another location away from Ground Zero. His goal to establish a beachhead for radical Islam at Ground Zero is nothing more than cynical triumphalism of the worst order. It surely qualifies as a brilliant fund-raising strategy across the Pan Islamic world though.
Texpat, I disagree on a couple of points. First, my xenophobe reference was directed only at the nutjob commenters that (for example) support a total ban on “Muslins” in Manhattan, government prohibiting their occupancy on religious reasons, or equally stupid statements. And there were plenty of them that actually made Michael Berry look sane. That shoe fits more than a few ignorant right wingers there.
Secondly, at the time of it’s posting, Jill’s article contained far more information specific to the building than was seen in other places, especially the right wing propaganda pumps like FoxNews and KTRH. Jill’s article was also more specific than your front page stuff that focused on the negative aspects of the name.
For the convenience of readers, here’s the portion of my comment on Jill’s blog that preceded the part that Texpat was kind enough to mention here.
Characterizing all Muslims as terrorists is about as smart or accurate as characterizing all Christians based on the likes of Phred Felps, or the most ignorant dominionist republican nutjobs on the State Board of Embarrassment. Yet, that’s what Berry and other right wing mouthpieces have quite intentionally done on this issue.
Again, my comment was directed at the xenophobes. Not people that are smart enough to do their own homework and not eat up every sensationalized talk show or pointed blog drivel they run across without independent thought.
#6 bob
Not all Muslims are terrorists.
Most (practically all) terrorist activity in the past several years has been perpetrated by Muslims.
Virtually all terrorist activity perpetrated by Muslims, especially in areas not predominantly Muslim, has been housed in a mosque and supported/financed by that mosque or a “charity” donated to by “run of the mill” Muslims (and non-Muslims). This holds for the 9/11 hijackers, btw.
Muslims, as a general rule, do not speak out against the terror and other violence perpetrated in the name of Islam. Many tacitly approve of it, especially when taking the targets into account.
The above leads rational people to think that putting a mosque anywhere near where the WTC once stood is at best a slap in the face of the US population, if not an outright provocation.
#3 I will leave the intellectual arguments to others. You are a fool. Only when a dull, rusted blade is held against your jugular vein will you realize how blind you have been.
Then it’s to late.
Enjoy your diversity…
Texpat, one more thing. This is completely beneath you. It was completely out of context and completely unnecessary (depending of course, on your actual motives, of which I’m increasingly unsure.)
We tread common ground in many areas, but sometimes you really disappoint me.
#7 WB, I’m glad to see that your not a xenophobic nutjob. Whatever amounts of money swindled from U.S. Muslims by religious snake oil salesmen and covertly diverted to fund violence is a drop in the bucket compared to the amount of financial and material support they get from the Saudis and Pakistan.
So, when do we invade?
#10 bob
Give me a break. I know the Saudi’s and others fund lots of evil activities. I also know that imams at mosques in this country actively support those activities. It is much easier for them to fund illicit activities in this country with funds that originate in this country. That, btw, is a side-effect of the eeeeeeeevil WoD and the emphasis placed on money laundering.
I don’t see where I mentioned anything about invading anywhere. We need to be observant of what is going on around us. When someone with an unsavory history wants to move in, it is only prudent that they and their motives be examined closely. The people behind this mosque are not simply proseletyzing and trying to win converts to their peaceful faith; they are making a political statement not only to people here, but even moreso to people abroad who wish us harm.
That mosque will not only serve as a fundraising object domestically, but will be an even greater one elsewhere as they show the Great Satan as being weak and able to be trifled with.
If you don’t see this and/or choose to ignore it, then you are whistling past the graveyard.
#9 Not surprisingly, I don’t see what your problem with Texpat is. You use that tactic quite frequently and, whether you intend it that way or not, people take it as Bob42 painting with a brush the size of a barn. In this case you come off as saying anyone that doesn’t think a mosque should be built at ground zero is a xenophobe. You’ve done the same thing with “homophobe”, “right wing authoritarian”, and “christian nutjobs” many times in the past.
But to the mosque. There is nothing “intellectually accurate” about Jill’s piece. You just happen to be on the same page. From my perspective its nothing more than an anecdotal story by a woman who likes her Muslim friend. It does nothing to address the concerns Texpat has brought up. “She’s my friend and I like her” isn’t enough to allay those concerns. On it’s face it was meant to be a provocative move. It’s a finger-wagging “ninny-ninny-boo-boo” in the face of America because they know they can get away with it. They are working our system to their advantage and if they were able to complete what they wanted, a worldwide Caliphate, bleeding heart multiculturalists and minarcho-libertarians such as yourself would be the second and third ones to face the bloody sword of Allah…right after they dispensed the Jews.
See lots of that around here.
WB is right, this place will house the most extreme of all radical Islamists. What a freaking tool.
#9 bob42
You are disappointed because I both cite and approve of something Dennis Prager wrote.
Are you kidding me ?
You cannot possibly be serious.
continuing my train of thought…
…while the “right-wing authoritarian Christian nutjobs” and “Zionists” are fighting to save y’alls “We are the World” happy asses.
#12 Hamous,
That’s pretty bizarre coming from a dude who used to routinely and purposefully depict all GLBT people as behaving like the Folsom street BDSM perverts.
Since you did not seem to comprehend the limitations and context I intentionally placed on my xenophobe characterization, here it is, again, bolded to improve your chances of understanding it the third time around
I fully understand how the location of the building is offensive to some people. I think that it would be more healthy and intellectually honest for them to recognize the emotional component of their offense instead of rationalizing it with notions that simply are not true.
Some, but clearly not all of the offended people’s remarks perfectly fit the definition of the word. And that is precisely why I concluded my comment with, “If the shoe fits…”
re: #15 That’s funny.
Ridiculous, but funny.
#14 Texpat, I am serious. Prager made an absurd hypothesis and went on to support it with narrow minded flimsy strawman arguments that a novice high school debate student could deconstruct with trivial effort. He not only failed to show causation, he didn’t even show correlation. He might as well have postulated that Hitler and Stalin did evil things because both men wore mustaches.
I was not disappointed because you simply posted Pragers illogical nonsense. I was disappointed because I think you’re smart enough to see it as the nonsensical crap that it is. Post what ever nonsensical propaganda you like, dude. LST has increasingly become pretty much your litter box of late and you’re certainly entitled and able to fill it with whatever brand of intellectually defunct crap you wish.
In my opinion, the overall quality of the content here has slightly but steadily declined since Big Jolly opened his own place.
Placing your statement in context ex post facto doesn’t do a whole lot to explain what you meant to the readers of your original characterization on another blog. When the use of “What I meant was…” is required routinely that may be an indication you’re not communicating your point effectively, don’t you think?
Heh, as you say, if the shoe fits…
#17 bob42
It is interesting to see you freely make serious accusations of Prager and yet somehow find it intellectually honest to fully omit anything to buttress your statements.
I really do not care if you agree with Prager or me. I also do not care whether you happen to like what I post and write about here on LST. You can be secure in the knowledge I do not give a damn about writing for your pleasure. I write for my own, fully aware the subjects and people I like and admire do not appeal to everyone.
Dave Jennings has his fans and I have mine. Some fans we have in common. The great majority of what the two of us publish covers very different ground. If you prefer his website to this one, rest assured I will lose not one moment of sleep over it.
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